The Relationships Thread of Discussing the Enigma that is Women

[TheKoopaDasher]

You should have tried to kiss her right there.

Man, I can't kiss her... Sure, it takes literally every ounce of energy in my body to prevent myself from kissing her when she has her arms wrapped around me... but I can't do it. It's not a healthy decision for me to get into a relationship right now. I'm angry all the time, I'm frustrated, I doubt myself, I have no confidence... basically I'm a mess. The only reason I even have my sanity right now is because she helps me keep it, but it would not be good for me to be in a relationship. I stress too much during relationships, and I can't handle more stress right now.

Besides, we were talking about our personalities in the classroom, and she said that I was "like a teddy bear". No one wants a relationship with their teddy bear. The teddy bear is the guilty pleasure you have when no one is around, the thing you cuddle when you've had a hard day. You don't take the teddy bear out to dinner, or home to see mom. I'm just her teddy bear.

[slimd1995]

Man, I can't kiss her... Sure, it takes literally every ounce of energy in my body to prevent myself from kissing her when she has her arms wrapped around me... but I can't do it. It's not a healthy decision for me to get into a relationship right now. I'm angry all the time, I'm frustrated, I doubt myself, I have no confidence... basically I'm a mess. The only reason I even have my sanity right now is because she helps me keep it, but it would not be good for me to be in a relationship. I stress too much during relationships, and I can't handle more stress right now.

Besides, we were talking about our personalities in the classroom, and she said that I was "like a teddy bear". No one wants a relationship with their teddy bear. The teddy bear is the guilty pleasure you have when no one is around, the thing you cuddle when you've had a hard day. You don't take the teddy bear out to dinner, or home to see mom. I'm just her teddy bear.

If you don't want a relationship, then why are you worrying about weather she's interested in you or not? She most likely is by the way. If you really don't want a relationship right now, you should probably tell her. Girls usually don't hold a platonic friend like that. She probably wanted you to make a move.

[coolguy753]

Girls usually don't hold a platonic friend like that. She probably wanted you to make a move.

I dunno. I mean, the friendzone is a genuine thing.

[slimd1995]

I dunno. I mean, the friendzone is a genuine thing.

Sure it is. But I've never heard of a guy being friendzoned so harshly that a girl will hold him and stare into his eyes for an extended period of time without being interested in him at all. And if that is what's happening in Koopa's case, then making a move would be a win-win situation. In one outcome, she would kiss him back and everything would be dandy. In the other outcome, she friendzones him and then Koopa can cut off all contact with her because that's a shitty thing to do.

[TheKoopaDasher]

If you don't want a relationship, then why are you worrying about weather she's interested in you or not? She most likely is by the way. If you really don't want a relationship right now, you should probably tell her. Girls usually don't hold a platonic friend like that. She probably wanted you to make a move.

Why am I worrying about it? Because she's the single most incredible girl I've ever met in my life. Turning her down for any reason at all would be like having Batman offer you a ride in the Batmobile, and you say "no thanks". When I'm with her, I feel this incredible peace. Everything in my life that I worry about, that I stress about, shuts down, and it's like the world only exists for the two of us. I worry about it because if she IS interested, I have a chance to be in a relationship with the most beautiful and most amazing girl I've ever met.

So why don't I just go for it? Because of the risk involved. What if she isn't interested? Best case scenario is everyone in the school finds out by the next morning and I spend the next two months living in hell seven hours a day as everyone I'm around takes the opportunity to laugh at my failure with her. The other side of the best case scenario for failure is that I still have to carpool with her to campus, and it will be really, really awkward, if not unbearable. The worst case scenario is that A) The best case scenario still happens, B) She tells all of her friends, who work at this school, and they kick me out before I can graduate, and C) She sends her massive dad after me to beat me into the ground.

As for the touchy-feely stuff, I thought the same thing. She wants me, that's why she touches me. I've never been touched like that by a girl I'm not dating. When I look into her eyes, all I see there is love and compassion and happiness. But at the same time... she flirts more than any girl I've ever met. Everyone in the school has come to know her as an incredible flirt, and most of the girls in the school hate her for it. That's just her personality. She's very touchy, she's very outgoing, and she's incredibly comfortable with everyone. So the touching is not a great indicator of interest.

That's why I go for other things... like how often I see her, and how often she makes an attempt to be near me. Outside of our drives to campus, I never see her. Admittedly, I rarely make an effort to go see her... but she doesn't make an effort to come see me, either. If I do see her in the halls, she is always very bubbly and happy and says hell or waves... but outside of school, I never talk to her. I don't have a WAY of contacting her. I don't have her number. She doesn't use Facebook. She's never made any indication that she would be interested in seeing me outside of school. Not even vague hints. When that bell rings, she is out the door and I don't see her again until the next day at class.

That's why I feel like she isn't interested. She's an independent girl. She's not the type to sit around and wait for someone. If she's interested in something or someone, she goes after it. If she was interested in me, I feel like she would show some sort of interest in seeing me outside of school. Something. But she doesn't. I've known her for two and a half years, and she has never once shown an interest in doing anything with me outside of class. Inside of class, any class, we're inseparable. She clings to me like a leech. But outside of school, I might as well not exist, because she has no interest in seeing me.

Then there's prom. She was going to go to prom with her boyfriend. She mentioned that before the breakup. In fact, it was the only time in the last two and a half years that she has even mentioned having a boyfriend. She told me that she was taking him to prom because her students were driving her crazy about coming to prom with them, and dancing with them. She used him as a crutch, as a "Back away from the merchandise" type thing. She talked about all of her dealings with prom almost every time I saw her. Then the breakup came. I haven't heard her mention prom since the breakup. At all. She doesn't have a date now, and if she doesn't get one, her students will drive her crazy. But she has yet to mention prom. And I didn't even hear about her breakup from HER... she has never TOLD me that she is single again... so for me to even KNOW that she is newly single would mean admitting the existence of my inner channels of knowledge about her. I'm the obvious choice as the next prom date... at least I think so. But she hasn't mentioned it. And I can't dance, at all. It would be a night of horror for me, trying to figure out how to dance. I'm pretty sure even if she asked me, I would say "no", simply because I can't dance.

It's a very frustrating situation. I'm very near making myself physically ill just thinking about it. Neither side of the coin is preferable. If I'm right, and she's not interested... then I feel like crap knowing that the most perfect girl I have ever met has no interest in me. If I make a move and she's not interested, my life becomes hell in a hundred different ways. If I'm wrong, and I don't make a move... then I've lost my chance to be with the most beautiful girl in the world. If I'm wrong and I do make a move, I'm in a relationship that is doomed to fail simply due to my own incompetence with women, and I'm setting myself up for a future heartbreak.

Ultimately, what sealed the deal for me into NOT saying anything to her and NOT making a move was the fact that I even feel the need to have this conversation. If it was a healthy relationship that I needed to be in, one that was a natural progression of our current relationship, I wouldn't be worrying about it like I am. If I trusted her the way that I should for us to be in a relationship, I would trust her to NOT screw me over and NOT break my heart and NOT ruin my life. But I don't. When I think about a rejection, the first thing I think about is her doing everything I already mentioned. When I think about a relationship, the first thing I think about is her remaining the flirt goddess she is and continuing to flirt with other guys. She will eventually leave me for one of those guys. I don't trust her not to. And since I don't trust her, I don't feel like I should be in a relationship with her. I haven't had a relationship in three years this month because my last ex broke my heart and cheated on me. I'm not putting myself through that again. I'm not putting myself in a relationship with someone that I don't trust to NOT do that to me. I'll be in a relationship again when I meet someone that I feel comfortable saying "This girl will not cheat on me".

[slimd1995]

One of your biggest problems is that you overthink everything.

[TheKoopaDasher]

One of your biggest problems is that you overthink everything.

"But in physics I soon learned to scent out the paths that led to the depths, and to disregard everything else, all the many things that clutter up the mind, and divert it from the essential. The hitch in this was, of course, the fact that one had to cram all this stuff into one's mind for the examination, whether one liked it or not."
~Albert Einstein

[TheKoopaDasher]

Why the hell do I do this to myself? She makes me HAPPY. In a world gone completely to hell, where every other aspect of my life leaves me frustrated and angry and doubtful of my own abilities, not only is she ALWAYS there for me, but she actually makes me forget about the world, leave it all behind, and somehow find happiness.

Why the ever-loving fuck would I try to do something to drive her away?

[stevencho]

I don't like the sound of this girl. Just recently broke up, a known flirt, not trustworthy. I just see this going very badly.

[Apollo]

Why the hell do I do this to myself? She makes me HAPPY. In a world gone completely to hell, where every other aspect of my life leaves me frustrated and angry and doubtful of my own abilities, not only is she ALWAYS there for me, but she actually makes me forget about the world, leave it all behind, and somehow find happiness.

Why the ever-loving fuck would I try to do something to drive her away?

I've been reading over this for a while, and have just now decided to say this.

Why don't you just ask her in private, "What does this mean? What does you putting your arms around me and looking into my eyes for ages mean?" Open up to her. Let her know that you've been heartbroken before and that you dont want to be confused again. I don't think she can take any offense to that. Get her to tell you what she feels.

Then, if the door seems open, go for it. If not, now you know, and you have NOTHING to worry about.

[TheKoopaDasher]

Final update on the situation with this girl.

I organized a date this week. We were going to have lunch, I had reserved a small gazebo next to the river, and I had waited until a perfectly warm day for us to be together, have a picnic, and enjoy being together. I had planned to tell her that I had a surprise for her, and I that I would like for her to join me for lunch. I was going to tell her that I wanted to thank her for everything she had done for me, and that I really appreciated her efforts, and that this surprise was my attempt to thank her for being there for me.

So I told her. She immediately shut down... I could see it in her eyes. And she started throwing enough excuses at me to sink a battleship. She couldn't do it because she had to drive home, because she had to do X, because she needed to do Y, because she had Z that was important that she usually did on that day... and without A she wouldn't have a good day tomorrow, and if she didn't do B people would be mad, and if it wasn't for C she couldn't survive. On and on and on, not just for that particular day that I asked about (I gave her a three-day notice) but for every day this week and next week. She left the room, and... I haven't seen her since. She hasn't been by to see me. She hasn't been in the halls. One time I walked by and she wouldn't wave (she always waves). Nothing at all from her. She might as well no longer exist.

But the thing is... I'm actually relieved that it didn't work. This is going to sound absolutely crazy, but the night before I told her, I was talking to a very close female friend of mine, and I realized something. This girl that I've been obsessed with... I don't have a relationship with her. When I say "relationship", I mean I don't have a base on which to form a romantic relationship. With my close female friend, I feel comfortable talking to her about anything. About everything. We share ideas and thoughts and suggestions and improvements. We have the same interests. And even though she's engaged, I love her dearly, and I care about her, not in the awkward dating way that I've "loved" every other girl I've met, but in the close friendship way where I would do anything for her. And that "friend" love is so much more powerful than anything I've felt for the girls that I've dated that it seems almost ridiculous to feel bad about this girl, who, at the end of the day, cared little for me and had no real relationship with me.

I feel like... in the future... if I am to be in a romantic relationship with someone, it needs to begin with a friendship love. I feel like... a romantic relationship should be such a small step up from what you already have with someone that you shouldn't even notice when it happens. You should be flirting with that line, crossing it occasionally, so that when you finally cross over, it's the most natural thing in the world. As it is, my relationships have been more like long-jumps. I completely skip over the part where I get to know the person and feel comfortable with them and trust them, and jump right into relationships. That's why I get burned. That's why I hate myself in relationships. That's why I'm never happy. So I resolve from now on to never get into a relationship without having a great friendship with that person first. Anything else, as far as I'm concerned, is doomed to fail.

[stevencho]

I feel like... in the future... if I am to be in a romantic relationship with someone, it needs to begin with a friendship love. I feel like... a romantic relationship should be such a small step up from what you already have with someone that you shouldn't even notice when it happens. You should be flirting with that line, crossing it occasionally, so that when you finally cross over, it's the most natural thing in the world. As it is, my relationships have been more like long-jumps. I completely skip over the part where I get to know the person and feel comfortable with them and trust them, and jump right into relationships. That's why I get burned. That's why I hate myself in relationships. That's why I'm never happy. So I resolve from now on to never get into a relationship without having a great friendship with that person first. Anything else, as far as I'm concerned, is doomed to fail.

Dude yes. Exactly. Thats what I've been trying to tell you.

[Nerdysimmer]

I feel like... in the future... if I am to be in a romantic relationship with someone, it needs to begin with a friendship love. I feel like... a romantic relationship should be such a small step up from what you already have with someone that you shouldn't even notice when it happens. You should be flirting with that line, crossing it occasionally, so that when you finally cross over, it's the most natural thing in the world. As it is, my relationships have been more like long-jumps. I completely skip over the part where I get to know the person and feel comfortable with them and trust them, and jump right into relationships. That's why I get burned. That's why I hate myself in relationships. That's why I'm never happy. So I resolve from now on to never get into a relationship without having a great friendship with that person first. Anything else, as far as I'm concerned, is doomed to fail.

Ding ding ding ding ding

I've really tried to explain it to you in the best I could in the archives of this thread, but I guess it's best that you've figured it out yourself.

[Mariolee]

So, tonight would have been the night I could have gone dancing. To top it off, I get stuck babysitting knowing that my friends are having a good time. Feels bad man, feels fucking bad man.

[TheKoopaDasher]

Ding ding ding ding ding

I've really tried to explain it to you in the best I could in the archives of this thread, but I guess it's best that you've figured it out yourself.

I didn't believe it until that night. I've never really had a friendship with a girl before... most of the time when I start to have a friendship with a girl, I fall for her, and then end up ruining things. With my female friend, that was never an option, because she's been engaged for the last three years. We just started talking, and we ended up discussing deep, personal things that I rarely, if ever, discuss with anyone. And it was at that moment that I realized that no relationship would ever work out if I felt MORE comfortable talking to other people about my relationship than I did talking to the person I was in the relationship with. I began stressing about this girl, worrying about what I should say and do, and that made me lose interest in her immediately, but what really changed my viewpoint was realizing that I feel more "love" for my female friend than I do for the girl I was supposedly in "love" with.

It's a strange feeling... I feel like this "love" for my friend is the first real, honest, true "love" I've ever felt, and every other "love" was just a different version of "lust".

[madoublex]

It's nice to know this story had a happy ending.

[stevencho]

You finally figured it out Koopa. So proud.

[TheKoopaDasher]

You finally figured it out Koopa. So proud.

Yeah... but I'm no closer to a real relationship than I am to becoming an astronaut and going to the moon. At this point there is no one in my life that I would even consider being in a relationship with. Now that the girl is no longer talking to me, I have quite literally no one in my life. No friends, no confidants. No one. The only friends I did have are off at other schools, and the only people I know at this school are at least ten years older than me and have kids and coaching activities and other things, and have no interest in going out and doing anything.

At this point I have no free time, and I'm slowly losing my sanity because it has been ages since I've done anything just for me, that I enjoy. And I won't have that opportunity for at least another month. Probably a year.

I'm finally at the point where I understand relationships, and I have no chance of even meeting someone that I could have one with for at least a year. Maybe more.

[stevencho]

Yeah... but I'm no closer to a real relationship than I am to becoming an astronaut and going to the moon. At this point there is no one in my life that I would even consider being in a relationship with. Now that the girl is no longer talking to me, I have quite literally no one in my life. No friends, no confidants. No one. The only friends I did have are off at other schools, and the only people I know at this school are at least ten years older than me and have kids and coaching activities and other things, and have no interest in going out and doing anything.

At this point I have no free time, and I'm slowly losing my sanity because it has been ages since I've done anything just for me, that I enjoy. And I won't have that opportunity for at least another month. Probably a year.

I'm finally at the point where I understand relationships, and I have no chance of even meeting someone that I could have one with for at least a year. Maybe more.

Just don't have the attitude that you need to be looking for a relationship. Just try building some good friendships with some girls and it will take care of itself.

[Higashi89]

Just don't have the attitude that you need to be looking for a relationship. Just try building some good friendships with some girls and it will take care of itself.

Sorry but I disagree. I mean, I understant that sometimes building a good relationship with a group of girls would eventually guide you to a serious relationship with one of them, but for me, it's more like you ending inside the friendzone.